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Post by Horsie on Mar 6, 2019 6:58:37 GMT
That loud squealing could very well have a psychological impact, like a sad little Stuka.
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Post by Canuovea on Mar 10, 2019 20:28:33 GMT
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Post by wordweaver3 on Mar 10, 2019 23:00:57 GMT
Seems like it would be better if it didn't attach to your arm.
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Post by wordweaver3 on Mar 11, 2019 19:28:53 GMT
Not entirely sure this is real.
It's a Lemat with an extension on the shotgun barrel.
Notice an issue?
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Post by Canuovea on Mar 11, 2019 22:45:26 GMT
He does say it would actually be better with a conventional grip. Yeah.
And that sure is a sight there. Hah.
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Post by Horsie on Mar 15, 2019 6:35:59 GMT
It could be real, the only site I found that mentioned it said it went to auction. From what little was said it sounds like that's an extension for the shotgun barrel, presumably the actual shotgun barrel stops at the "barrel band" like on a normal LeMat, and that extension attaches to it somehow.
It's probably something special ordered by someone, there were some really questionable options for some guns in the 19th Century, but having to attach that extension every time you want a long barrel (and making sure you've got the firing pin set right so you don't shoot the sight off) seems too awkward to even be considered for commercial sale.
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Post by wordweaver3 on Mar 15, 2019 6:51:28 GMT
I suppose the idea was to give it some sporting purpose. I suppose it would function as a shotgun for small game in that configuration. But even if you removed the site completely you couldn't shoot the revolver since recoil would make you hit the barrel. It would basically be shotgun only like that. It would have been cheaper to just buy a single shot muzzle loading shotgun.
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Post by Horsie on Mar 15, 2019 18:06:11 GMT
Yeah, that's why I'm thinking it was a custom order, back then most manufacturers seem to have made odd one-offs if people were willing to pay a bit more. My guess is someone wanted a revolver most of the time, but figured it'd be handy to be able to stick an extension on the shotgun barrel when he felt like shooting small game. Which just seems even stupider the longer I look at it; not only would you not be able to use the pistol barrel with the shotgun barrel attached, not only would it make for an awkward shotgun, but you'd have to carry that barrel around too, and some tools to install and remove it.
It'd probably be a lot cheaper and easier to just buy a revolver and smoothbore musket.
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Post by Horsie on Mar 16, 2019 22:40:26 GMT
I had a look at a revolver shotgun in .410 today, made by Lazer Arms (I've never heard of them, but they seem to be one of the Turkish manufacturers now selling cheap, dodgy firearms in Canada).
Everything about it felt okay, everything was smooth, it was comfortable to shoulder, it's got a shield all the way around the front of the cylinder to cover the flashgap, but it felt like a toy. I looked it up when I got home and every site that's carrying it says it weighs 9lbs, but most of my rifles are in the 9-10lb range, and this was nowhere close. It was substantially lighter than the Henry .410 I handled right after, and Henry says their gun weighs a little over 7lbs. I'm thinking it's mostly made of aluminium, which isn't an issue with something like a Mossberg or an AR where you've got a bolt locking directly into the barrel, but in something like this I can see it being a problem.
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Post by wordweaver3 on Mar 17, 2019 3:30:42 GMT
I don't think we get those in the states. It looks pretty though.
I don't know if the low pressure of a .410 would be a problem if it's made of aluminum, especially if it has steel sleeves in the chambers. Might be an issue if you stuck a .45 LC in it.
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Post by Horsie on Mar 17, 2019 3:54:14 GMT
Definitely, the sites carrying these all specify that firing .45LC in one is dangerous. There's another one available called the Canuck something or other, it's also Turkish, and looking at photos it seems to be the exact same gun. I heard they had quality control and reliability issues with those ones.
The problem I have with aluminium guns is that if they're not made right, or not made with the right type of aluminium, then they can wear out pretty fast. The German police used the P1, which was an aluminium P38, and they had serious issues with wear and broken frames, I know a few guys at the range I go to who've owned old aluminium frame .22cal revolvers (made in Germany in the 60s or 70s I think), they tended to have issues with steel parts wearing the frames, and the frames stretching over time.
At the same time you can get plenty of aluminium guns that work just fine, the only people I know who've had serious issues with Mossberg pump shotguns were people who did stupid shit (like load 3-1/2" steel shot into a gun with a 2-3/4" chamber), and almost all ARs are aluminium, but... we're talking about a Turkish gun. A lot of them look pretty good, and some (like this one) aren't exactly cheap, but in a lot of cases the quality of construction isn't there.
Plus, it kind of pisses me off that most of these things are sold under names like "Canuck" or "Dominion", as if they're trying to make people think they're made in Canada.
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Post by wordweaver3 on Mar 17, 2019 4:17:20 GMT
For the price it seems a poor competition for the Rossi Circuit Judge, which can shoot shotshells and .45 lc standard pressure loads. Seems to be in the same price range and does less.
Unless there are legal reasons that you can't get the Circuit Judge in Canada?
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Post by Horsie on Mar 17, 2019 5:16:35 GMT
We can get the Rossi, but it's classified as restricted, so you can't hunt with it. It's because they're built on the same frame as the Taurus Judge, so the idea is that if they were non-restricted (and therefore not registered) you could potentially get a non-registered pistol by installing a Taurus Judge barrel onto a Rossi Circuit Judge frame, while the Lazer and Canuck shotguns are built on dedicated frames.
This is to prevent illegal modifications that turn what would otherwise be non-restricted long guns into restricted pistols, which is kind of ridiculous when I can turn a break action shotgun into a pistol with a hacksaw in my garage in a couple of minutes, but the average Joe sure as fuck isn't going to go through the trouble of sourcing a Taurus Judge barrel, removing the barrel from his Rossi shotgun, and installing the pistol barrel onto his shotgun.
It's the same sort of logic that makes rifles built on full-auto receivers illegal because someone could undo the modifications that prevent the installation of full-auto parts, ignoring the fact that anyone with the know how to undo those modifications and make a full-auto fire control group could just as easily do that with a dedicated semi-auto receiver too.
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Post by wordweaver3 on Mar 17, 2019 18:29:59 GMT
I suppose hacksaws are illegal too?
The whole concept of passing regulations to ensure that people don't break laws seems goofy. If someone is willing to break one law it stands to reason they'll break two. Plus, all that does is make the harder and more expensive route to breaking the law more difficult, so they'll just do it the easy and cheap way, which would be harder to track.
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Post by Horsie on Mar 17, 2019 19:22:27 GMT
Now that I'm looking at this again, it's even more ridiculous.
A rifle or shotgun with a barrel length shorter than 18.5" and/or an OA length shorter than 26" is considered restricted, but that only seems to apply to semi-autos, which is why that Henry Mare's Leg lever-action is non-restricted despite having a 13" barrel and OA length of 25", so technically you can hunt with that. By comparison, the M1 Carbine is restricted, so it's basically treated like a pistol, because it's a semi-auto with an 18" barrel.
Even stranger, it sounds like the regulations only have a problem with modifying a stock or barrel to shorten the barrel length and OA length of a non-semi-auto rifle or shotgun below that 18.5" and 26" mark, but not purchasing and installing factory made parts that result in the same shorter length. So if I'm reading this right, I'd still have a non-restricted rifle if I bought a full-length .44mag Henry, then swapped out the stock, barrel, and mag with one from a Mare's Leg, however it'd be an illegal prohibited firearm if I cut down the barrel and stock myself.
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