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Post by Canuovea on Feb 10, 2019 21:25:17 GMT
This is great.
Jehovah's Witnesses manage to not check one box, according to this guy, but they get the rest.
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Post by StyxD on Feb 10, 2019 22:53:24 GMT
Perhaps I'm jaded (or the checklist is) but mainstream Catholicism doesn't check two boxes, three at most…
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Post by Canuovea on Feb 10, 2019 22:57:30 GMT
Hahaha, yeah, my girlfriend and I ran through this thing with Catholicism in mind. We got 4 boxes not checked. She then said, "but in Poland I could see this box being checked. From what I saw when I visited that one time."
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Post by StyxD on Feb 10, 2019 23:27:35 GMT
Now I kinda curious how our guesses aligned. Although to be fair, Catholicism easily scores all the boxes about the leader, considering the pope is an internationally-sanctioned absolute monarch of his tiny city district empire. The boxes that are off, according to me: - Mind-altering practices - not entirely discouraged, but not relied upon as in some of fundamentalist protestant groups.
- Cut ties with family and friends - not really
- Devote inordinate amounts of time to the group - not really
- Iffy: justify whatever means it deems necessary - they don't outright teach it, but church institutions will totally act in violation of law and morality if it gets them closer to their sacred goals (which seem to be these days: repression of women's rights and sexual minorities)
So I guess it's 3-4, not 2-3, I missed one on my first reading. |
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Post by Harkovast on Feb 10, 2019 23:49:07 GMT
I will do this but if Harkovast fandom isn't a cult I will be really disappointed.
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Post by Harkovast on Feb 10, 2019 23:50:50 GMT
damn it, you guys question me all the time.
You are the worst cultists ever....god damn free thinking bastards!
Now when I commit mas suicide and its just me I am going to look ridiculous.
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Post by StyxD on Feb 10, 2019 23:53:13 GMT
Yeah, I thought about these points in context of Harkovast too, but then it turned out the leader has no sway over us and is subject to authorities, so I didn't delve further. Maybe the RPGs count as mind-altering practices?  |
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Post by Harkovast on Feb 10, 2019 23:56:21 GMT
Honestly, this makes us sound as far from a cult as its possible to imagine.
I couldn't persuade you guys that grass is green.
I guess maybe that's a good thing after all. We all want to be able to make everyone agree with us...but cults show that that can be a dangerous power to wield.
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Post by Horsie on Feb 11, 2019 0:06:59 GMT
Dunno, I'd be cool with forcing you all to admit that Gotetra are superior. Frankly, I'm surprised it's not self-evident.
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Post by Canuovea on Feb 11, 2019 0:33:28 GMT
1) My girlfriend (She went to Krakow and Warsaw, by the way. The day she was in Krakow they had a "pro-family" parade that was anti-abortion and homophobic) disagreed with me on the subject of mind altering practices. She doesn't think so, but I do. Rosaries and such, pray X number of times to eliminate your sin, speaking in tongues, etc. Personally I think the X number of prayers for Y sin(s) seems to me an attempt to make people view themselves and their actions a certain way (and definitely suppress doubts). Keeping in mind that meditation can count... Still, she has a point when saying that it isn't necessarily "in excess" depending on which branch of the Catholic Church counts. That being said, I did read a paper that going through ritual and repetitive activities can start to make you believe in things you otherwise wouldn't, which seems to count, and the Catholic Church has a lot of ritual.
2) We both agreed that "ends justify the means" wasn't necessarily true for the majority, but certainly for the upper echelons. Definitely a bit iffy.
3) "Subservience to the leader or group requires members to cut ties with family and friends, and radically alter the personal goals and activities they had before joining the group." Nope. Certainly not "requires" unless you go into the priesthood, and even then only partially.
4) "Members are expected to devote inordinate amounts of time to the group and group-related activities." Define 'inordinate'. So we didn't choose this one.
5) "Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members." Not "required" really. At least not over here. And even "encouraged" seems wrong. Instead you're "encouraged" to convert them. That being said, I've seen plenty of literature telling women to not marry non-Christian men, but can't recall if that was Catholic. It certainly wasn't only Catholic. Also, I, as an Atheist kid, was let into a Catholic school for grades 6-7, so...
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Post by Horsie on Feb 11, 2019 2:38:20 GMT
I thought the Catholic Church frowned on speaking in tongues? That's one of those things, like prophets running around everywhere, that stopped centuries ago (because God knows it'd be a threat to the Church's power if someone claimed to have a direct line to God).
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Post by Canuovea on Feb 11, 2019 3:38:16 GMT
You'd think so but some of them do still do it. My girlfriend has seen it happen.
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Post by Horsie on Feb 11, 2019 4:07:53 GMT
That has to be a fringe thing, something some group of misguided Catholics picked up from the Pentecostals or one of these other "holy rolling" protestant churches.
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Post by Canuovea on Feb 11, 2019 5:11:27 GMT
Could be.
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Post by wordweaver3 on Feb 11, 2019 5:36:56 GMT
That being said, I've seen plenty of literature telling women to not marry non-Christian men, but can't recall if that was Catholic.
To be fair, it's typically considered bad for a marriage if both parties practice different religions. Not only from a religious standpoint but from a common sense one as well. Since so much of religion has to do with how best to conduct yourself in a marriage and as a parent there's going to be strife in the family regarding who thinks what is best based on their beliefs. If one wants a bris and the other wants a baptism for their child that's going to be a major issue.
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