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Post by Harkovast on Jul 27, 2017 21:10:36 GMT
Holy shit! Norsca has been announced as DLC for total war warhammer 1! A lot of you might not care, because you don't have the game and don't like Warhammer. Well I don't care! I will talk to Canuovea! He gets it!
I was a bit skeptical when I first heard rumours about Norsca. With Chaos warriros already in the game, how could Norsca be made interesting? But now I've got some more information, its completely blown me away. Rather than the generic norse leaders we had before, now we will get Wulfrick the Wanderer and Throg the Troll King, who are both really bad ass, really interesting characters from the lore. The Norscans get fucking war mammoths! These guys are bad mother fuckers.
And, most mind blowing of all...they get fimirs. What the fuck is a fimir? Back in the 80s, games workshop wanted to create their own iconic fantasy race. They came up with one eyed, reptilian monsters with club tails called fimirs. The fimirs had a few issues. The main one was that their women were all sterile and can't get pregnant, so the fimir abduct human women to rape. Yeah....one eyed rape monsters.
Another problem was that the models were made too big relative to their stats, so they looked ogre sized but had stats like an orc, so they seemed very weak for what they were.
They never caught on and were quietly dropped. The biggest look in they got was during the classic board game Hero Quest, which included some cool models for them.
Recently they got brought back by forge world, with new, less rapey background. Fimirs are now an ancient race that used to be the favourites of the chaos gods, but now they are more interested in humans, and the fimirs get ignored by them and have declined to the fringes of the world (how meta!) The reason fimirs appearing is such a big deal is it shows that creative assembly are really mining into the warhammer lore. We're now getting really obscure races and factions, which means there's more potential for really interesting things later. Basically anything is on the table now, as even super obscure units and factions may now get a look in, including those from forge world (meaning chaos dwarves in a later game are a certainty.)
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Post by Canuovea on Jul 29, 2017 16:40:41 GMT
And as you have a preorder for Warhammer 2, Hark, you automatically get Norsca for free. That's hilarious in terms of how good a deal it is for folks who were already going to buy TWW2.
Norsca seems to have really great value.
Fimir seem cool as well, but I'm really glad they got rid of the rape backstory. Them as cast aside tools of the Dark Gods is rather interesting.
However, for me, I'm much more interested in how this makes it possible to put minor factions into the game. Most importantly, I want Tilea, Estalia, and the Border Princes. Not-Italians, Not-Spanish, with pikes, shot, Renaissance fantasy tech, pavise crossbows, quickly relocating cannons, etc? Yes please. Gimmie.
There has also been some talk of Araby. No idea for sure until Game 2 comes out, but one user in the forums has gone on an Anti-Araby Crusade about how Warhammer is European and nobody is interested in a "Superpower blob called Araby" because it takes away from the Eurocentricism of Warhammer. Instead he proposes we get Not-China, Not-India, and Not-Japan, along with Not-Celtic Britain (who would be a rival for Not-Spain because that's real world historical), and the Amazons. I see no reason not to have all of these, but certainly Araby, which will control a large chunk of the map in the second game... at least in theory... would come earlier than some of these. Of course, it has only resulted in Araby becoming more popular.
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Post by Harkovast on Jul 29, 2017 19:52:05 GMT
Whenever people talk about adding or not adding anything relating to a real world culture or race some people lose their damn minds. This desperation to be outraged and offended is a plague on modern society! A plague I tells ya! Warhammer has chaos dwarves, who are kind of assyrian and Ogres that have a mongol vibe, and there are overtly Egyptian tomb kings. And Lizard men! They are fucking Aztec! The old world is europe but trying to pretend the setting is entirely europe based is moronic. Araby already had an army in warmaster and a few models in the dogs of war army. They even got a cool boat in Dreadfleet. The idea that some how including something that is in the background already would make the game less true to the background... I dunno I think we're learning more about the person complaining than about the thing they are complaining about.
Obviously main factions are the priority, but I will take any and all minor factions as a very welcome bonus. Hell, if they made a game 4 and started doing Kingdom of Ind and Nippon and just started inventing stuff I'd be completely up for that.
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Post by Canuovea on Jul 29, 2017 20:40:26 GMT
I do sometimes worry that people might be offended by Araby, since GW was never known for its, ahem, giving a damn about the cultures it rips off. That being said, I'm a Canadian and we all know what GW thinks of them... We all know I'm just looking for an excuse to enslave you all and take over Atlantis. CA has recently said that they would be perfectly willing to look into lore to create new units and such that Games Workshop never bothered with, so there is hope for a lot. Additionally, we were told that they were not going to do Campaign Packs anymore, now they just have two types of race packs... one that is like the standard one they have now, and one that comes with 4 Legendary Lords and a larger roster. Now here is the trick... the only main faction that could possibly be sold as DLC for the second game is the Tomb Kings. They could pull that 4LLs off, especially if they mixed and matched a bit. Settra, Khalida, Arkhan (maybe), and some random bloke and/or just throw in Neferata for the Vampires too. But if that is the only Race Pack DLC... it seems unlikely. Game one got Chaos Warriors (kinda), Beastmen, Wood Elves, Bretonnia (for free), and of course Norsca now. Even if you take away Warriors of Chaos and Norsca as being simply Pre-Order... Beastmen, Wood Elves, and Bretonnia are still three races added to the game. This is ignoring factions for existing races added by either FLC or Lord packs. I therefore doubt we are only going to get Tomb Kings for game two. Therefore I think we are likely to see at least the Southern Realms OR Araby. Maybe both. Personally, I think we'll see the Southern Realms (or at least specifically Tilea and/or Estalia), since they have a presence in both TWW 1 and TWW2. Add to this the fact that Tilea's capital has a special garrison and is a Capital building like Altdorf or Drakenhoff (and so comes with that free Garrison and a boost to local income), the fact that said capital building is one of the main faction capitals targeted by the Norscans and their technology tree... starting to look plausible. You could easily add something to the Southern Realms, a roster for instance, and have it impact both TWW1 and TWW2, a double whammy of awesome.
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Post by Harkovast on Jul 29, 2017 22:22:47 GMT
I FUCKING KNEW IT!
In fairness, they made the trailer for you guys make your leader seem like Darth Vader, which was pretty bad ass.
Regarding Tilea, Dogs of War were, at one time, an official army, so a full roster of units, background and all the rest are basically all there and ready to go.
The good thing with an araby expansion is it wouldnt be games workshop doing it, it would be creative assembly, who I have a lot more faith in at this point.
Ooh total war speculation is fun! When Total War Warhammer was first announced I remember be sceptical becuase their were just 4 factions declared. Clearly that concern has been more than addressed by this point! Originally I was thinking we would never get lesser facitons like beastmen, ogre kingdoms or chaos dwarves. Now were debating Tilea, Kislev and fucking Araby? I love it!
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Post by Canuovea on Jul 29, 2017 23:42:35 GMT
They said early on that the main 16 factions (presumably including Chaos Dwarfs) were going to definitely happen.
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Post by Harkovast on Jul 30, 2017 2:08:11 GMT
It seems odd now, but back when the first game came out I remember chaos being a preorder bonus or something you had to buy separately was considered very controversial. Chaos is such a central part of the warhammer world that making them a costly extra rubbed people the wrong way. Not to mention, day one DLC generally gets people annoyed. Now having played hte game, its obvious why chaos are DLC as they don't play like a normal faction at all. They are more like a game condition to most opponents, and playign them turns the whole game on its head. I think it was also a case of people under estimating how much work is involved in all these factions. They are not just a reskin and a few tweaked stats like in previous total war games but rebuilt completely and totally different to all the others.
I think making the bonus DLC this time something for the first game is a clever way for them to side step the problem. Obviously they don't want to generate bad press again, but they also want to reward the early adopters. It also encourages people to want to own both games, so it seems like smart business.
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Post by Canuovea on Jul 30, 2017 2:37:45 GMT
Yeah, a clever move by CA.
Chaos was originally to be unplayable kinda like the Mongols in Medieval 2. People bitched. CA went to SEGA asking for the funds to make it playable, they said yes but as DLC... so CA gave it to folks for free up until the end of the first week after release if you bought the game. And of course people bitched. So there you go. I feel sorry for developers after all this.
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Post by Harkovast on Jul 30, 2017 2:51:51 GMT
Yeah I think the reaction was reasonable from the fans at the time, but looking back on it with all the facts now the developers had good motives and it was unfair that they got shit for it.
Still, they went on to have the most successful instalment of the insanely successful total war series to date, so I guess they got a happy ending.
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Post by Canuovea on Jul 30, 2017 3:00:18 GMT
True enough.
I suppose, though, that as a content creator of that size you really have to just not listen to people at all or you'd have the self esteem of a rock in the span of a week.
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Post by Harkovast on Jul 31, 2017 17:50:20 GMT
They said Bretonnia was the last thing for Total war one, but now we've had Krell added and now Norsca, so maybe we will get more characters in the future?
One's I want to see- Ariel, the queen of the woodelves, who turns into a giant moth winged demi god for battle. She is the consort of Orion, so if we have him we should get her too! Woodelves dont have a focused spell casting special character, and she gets mentioned in the game by Orion on the negociation screen. PUT HER IN!
Valtan, the reincarnation of sigmar guy. Its the end times, we've got Archaon, we need Valtan to fight him! In the background he aquires different magic items and gets better and better equipped, which is what you do in this game any way!
Who else would be good to see added?
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Post by Harkovast on Jul 31, 2017 18:38:27 GMT
Skaven added into the map for the first game! We need it!
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Post by Canuovea on Aug 2, 2017 1:46:56 GMT
Skaven being added would be nice. Not sure how backwards compatible it will be, but they should be added anyway.
Ariel would be neat, though technically Durthu, the killing tree, can be specced up as a mage.
Valten might be neat, but that would result in two Ghal Maraz's in game at once. Personally, I think the Empire needs another starting location. So either the bringer of Toddlers in Middenheim or Marius Leitdorf in Averland. Considering Marius is both amazing and hilarious I want him in. Todbringer, though, could come with new units.
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Post by Harkovast on Aug 2, 2017 17:00:42 GMT
Well I guess if those ideas suck, the good news is that at least I don't work for creative assembly.
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Post by Harkovast on Aug 2, 2017 17:09:01 GMT
The next update will apparently include Regiments of Renown for Beastmen and perhaps other sides that don't yet have them. People spotted the Beastman ones on a lets play showing off the Norscan stuff.
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